The Brink of Morosity

Did the libertarian project fail?

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Get your bingo cards ready once again, because today’s Remnant offers a greatest hits of Goldbergian geekdom. Jonah’s joined today by libertarian writer Brink Lindsey, a senior vice president at the Niskanen Center and the author of The Permanent Problem on Substack. Together, they dig into urgent matters of social policy—institutional decay and the challenges of modern capitalism among them—libertarian philosophy, and Thailand’s problematic geography. Did the libertarian project fail? Do intellectuals really shape the world? And how can we make the mass affluence provided by capitalism sustainable?

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Show Notes:

–Brink’s Substack, The Permanent Problem

–The Captured Economy

–The Age of Abundance

–Liberaltarians

–Brink: “Life Under ‘an Immense and Tutelary Power’”

–Brink: “The Advance of the Monoculture”

–Brink: “Libertarian Roots Revisited”

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Comments (21)
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  1. Avatar photo
    Ben Connelly

    This was enjoyable, although I’m always frustrated by the “left-libertarian” thing. True, in elite circles, libertarians sometimes try to cozy up to leftists because the left is cool and the right isn’t. But at the grassroots in the United States of America, libertarians overwhelmingly identify as right-wing (just read the comments at Reason magazine). There isn’t nothing to the “we’re neither right nor left” stuff, but apart from some misguided market socialists and some hardcore socially-liberal libertarians who deviate slightly from libertarian orthodoxy on role of government and economics, so-called “left-libertarians” end up either not being good leftists, or not being good libertarians. They’re closer to one or the other. Sure, libertarians love to talk about human progress. But progressivism is antithetical to small government and it’s an illusion to believe they can ever align their cause with progressives.

    I can’t wait to listen to the Ruminant because I’m hoping Jonah riffs for a while on the positive vs. negative liberty argument which he began in the last four minutes of this podcast. (If you still read these, Jonah, maybe it would be good to have a debate on the Remnant between a self-described “right-libertarian” and a self-described “left-libertarian.”)

    Honestly the elite-circle libertarians’ willingness to cozy up to the left is probably what drove a lot of grassroots libertarians towards Rothbardian-Hoppean anarcho-capitalism.

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    1. Tmbaer

      but the right these days has given up on small-government things libertarians care about, like free trade and low spending. I think the effort to cozy up to the centralist Dems is more because of changes in the right than the left. the official national big-l Libertarian Party is now even more of a right-leaning, populist/nativist/trumpist party. but it's one that is repulsive to so many libertarians, who go left in response

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        Ben Connelly

        Yeah but the left isn’t any better in spending.

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  2. Avatar photo
    Mmaughan0

    His point about vast corporate bureaucracies habituating us to becoming drones and atrophying our independent entrepreneurial streak was notably argued by Hayek in the Constitution of Liberty. This has been a concern since the immediate postwar years. Not to say Lindsey is wrong just that it isn’t new.

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    1. Avatar photo
      Ben Connelly

      Yeah, and before that Tocqueville. I’m guessing Lindsay has read Hayek and Tocqueville and just didn’t mention their names.

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      1. Avatar photo
        Mmaughan0

        Fair. Would be interesting to hear him explain if it’s different/worse/accelerating

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          Ben Connelly

          My guess is accelerating/worse

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  3. P Satter

    Part way into the podcast:
    Hong Kong to Washington DC: 8,149.96 miles (13,101.62 km)
    Bangkok to Washington DC: 8,797.67 miles (14,158.48 km)

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  4. John Matthew IV

    For the AMA, I would love to get Jonah's thoughts on Heather Cox Richardson. She has the most popular Substack newsletter but stopped reading because of her liberal bias.

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    1. Avatar photo
      DougAz

      I'm a huge HCR fan. She explains actual factual history. Albeit with a narrative that Conservatives don't like.

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  5. Avatar photo
    Dana

    Jonah I hope you are checking comments - you may be the only person who can (via The Fair Jessica) get something thru to Haley and I’m sorry I’m jumping into comments for another pod on this (that I will listen to as I always do) - but so help me if Haley doesn’t make a huge f’ing deal of the fact that Vivek et al keep talking over the only woman on that stage, I might throw something thru a window. There are so many pro-Nikki women out there and THAT would be a standout moment in the (thankfully) last debate/mudwrestling. I’m sorry bc it’s not something I would normally even consider bringing up since you’re in this weird position re her, but I’m out of options and it’s not even a question of her per se but how automatically they think she can be steamrolled over. Every woman everywhere has had this experience and it sucks. Glad you’re back home safe!

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  6. Avatar photo
    Kyzyl Tuva

    Great one Jonah. Love the intellectual history topic. I am reminded of this passage from Julien Benda:

    “ Peace is only possible if men cease to place their happiness in the possession of things which cannot be shared, and if they raise themselves to a point where they adopt an abstract principle superior to their egotisms. In other words, it can only be obtained by a
    betterment of human morality.”

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  7. Alex Weiss

    Hi Jonah (and Guy),
    This is for the AMA podcast. I’ve been listening to Liberal Fascisim while intermingling it with current content from The Dispatch and I finally heard you mention briefly about how your views have changed slightly since the book came out. Specifically you mentioned horseshoe theory and how it went against the book and how you’ve come to accept the theory (paraphrasing and may not be remembering everything correctly), so my question is; How would you update the book for 2023 if you were to write a revised edition? Thanks for everything, love the show.

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  8. Philebus

    Interesting guest. I wish the audio had been better, but the guy is in Thailand (insert shoulder shrug). Dunno, maybe AI can fix these things - looking forward to a better future, where my needs are served more completely (yes, color me self-absorbed). And in that vein: could we possibly get any more annoying advertisements to disrupt my train of thought (just saying...my self-absorbed public service rant of the day).

    I was born in 1959 (which makes me old), and as I consider the great amount of technological change that has occurred in that time, the question always comes up as to how it could've been different. I recently built a new computer, and through some ancillary research came across a photo of a 1 Gig hard drive from 1981 (browser search will take you to images). It was as big as a 2.0 liter engine block, and now the same thing (and more) can be secured in an SSD the size of a stick of gum (kinda cool). Things move forward, and some may consider it to be for the worst - "the world's going to hell in a handbasket" - I'm not in that camp (I'm hopeful).

    Which leads me to this statement which is very Hayekian: It may be best to keep things simple in the hearts of men, because no one can see the full scope of things. Organic development is good - you may not like it in retrospect, but that is the way forward - the future can't be denied - take what useless baggage you need and move forward (it's time honored), and the good junk will find a way. I doubt it can be any different.

    Sorry. I will read up on Brink Lindsey... I am a Libertarian at heart.

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  9. J. Mark Graham

    I was super disappointed the Skiff wasn't actually a reference to a SCIF, or Secure Compartmented Information Facility (SCIF), meaning we could get some good national security discussion, which is my mind is the ONLY weak link in the Dispatch.

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    Coveredwagon379

    Something is off with the volume of this episode. It’s way too low and I can’t hear what they are saying.

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