Don’t Forget the Attempted Theft

Trump’s efforts to overturn the election riled up his supporters long before the violence at the Capitol.

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An attempted bank robber who doesn’t hurt anybody is still guilty of attempted bank robbery. If someone gets hurt, though, the penalties are greater even if the robber didn’t intend harm.

This is how I think about what Donald Trump did last week. Of course the violence makes everything worse. But whatever blame he deserves for inciting a mob—and I think he deserves quite a lot—the ransacking of the Capitol should be understood as merely compounding the original caper: to steal the election he lost.  

Let’s look at the record. 

For months, Trump dodged answering whether he’d respect the results of the 2020 election. Why? Because, as he often says, he likes to keep his options open. 

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  1. Avatar photo
    DJS


    "Another was bludgeoned to death with a fire extinguisher."

    This could stand to be updated, I have it on good authority that we now know that this is not what happened:

    https://factcheck.thedispatch.com/p/fact-checking-joe-bidens-comment

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    The Stray Goose

    Yet again Mr Goldberg clearly says what I was thinking.

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  3. Avatar photo
    Jen

    Ben Sasse gave some comments to a local newspaper. He was quite harsh. He wouldn’t say how he would vote but based on his comments I don’t see how he could vote to acquit. My guess is because there’s a trial he’s not going to announce which way he will vote before the trial. In fact I think it was awful that Lindsey Graham and Tim Scott came out against removal before the trial started having not heard any of the evidence/arguments.

    https://omaha.com/news/local/govt-and-politics/sen-sasse-wont-say-how-hell-vote-on-trumps-second-impeachment/article_444e0d72-55f6-11eb-8ac0-b7203250f9ea.html

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    Todd T

    That Fiona Hill article is required reading. She’s an assassin.

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  5. Janet STL

    Yep.

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  6. Nickson

    As a professor of mine once observed, reckless crimes are often more culpable than intentional ones, if the objective is societal protection.

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    PC Albright

    Recall his claim that voters fraud cost him the Iowa caucuses in 2016. His stated unwillingness to accept a Clinton win since according to him the only way she could win was through voter fraud. His claims that he won the 2016 popular vote in reality, and that any result otherwise was due to massive voter fraud --- which turned into the Kobach commission that found nada. A serious question is whether his pathologies actually drove him to believe all this nonsense or if it is just driven by intense cynicism about democracy.

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    Scarlette Tarte

    Lot's of people claimed that he was setting up a steal long before the election. The Atlantic wrote a whole piece published before the election laying out the steps Trump would take that would lead to an attempted coup. They got it 98% right.

    The truth is, a whole lot of us were YELLING all this stuff about how bad Trump was for YEARS. People refused to listen. Especially people on the right.

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  9. Avatar photo
    Connie

    People were legitimately afraid of COVID. I completely understood state boards of election attempting to reasonably accommodate their citizens who wanted to vote, but for fear of COVID, did not want to vote in person.

    We were having national elections in a pandemic that was killing thousands daily.

    Let’s talk about Pennsylvania and those late arriving ballots. Does anyone here not have a story about the lack of USPS efficiency these last months? That’s putting it mildly. I mailed a Christmas card on 8 December to a house that is a three-and-a-half hour drive from my home. The card arrived there on 23 December. My nephew sent me a Christmas gift that still has not arrived. So, it was entirely reasonable (and agreed to by both parties on the election board) to make a modest allowance for late arriving ballots.

    I think Trump knew exactly what he was doing when he sent his mob to the Capitol. I do believe Trump was trying to stage a coup. He admires authoritarians, he delighted in the Capitol violence (according to Ben Sasse), he invited the military, police and Secret Service to join him on stage as he extolled the honesty of Third World elections.

    This man not only needs to be impeached. He needs to be prosecuted. He is a clear and present danger to our Republic.

    John Kelly was interviewed by Jake Tapper the day after the Capitol riots. Here are a few of his quotes:

    “The President knows who he is talking to when he tweets or when he makes statements. He knows who he’s talking to; he knows what he wants them to do.”

    “But when you work closely with him, you understand, ah, you know, very very ah... He’s a very very flawed human being.”

    “... I would just say, very flawed man who’s got some serious character issues.”

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    1. Avatar photo
      Pat Riot

      Don't impeach, imprison.

      I continue to be the outlier here and be the one who *opposes* Trump's impeachment because it's a waste of time and a punishment that is a relative slap on the wrist.

      Make the punishment fit the crime. Bring Trump up on charges that any other American citizen would face after the actions he's taken. Prosecute him to the fullest extent of the law.

      Let thousands of victims of the violence sue him and his family into the stone age.

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      1. Avatar photo
        Lindy

        One does not preclude the other. It's not either/or. Congress can impeach, and Trump can still be charged or sued. They have different purposes, and different criteria. Impeachment does not even require illegality.

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          Pat Riot

          I get that, which is why I should probably say I'm *ambivalent* about impeachment. I like the symbolism, but I fear it would detract from fervor to prosecute.

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    Kevin Johnson

    Right you are, Jonah. I was among those questioning your use of “Trump is trying to steal the election.” I dismissed his pathetic loser actions as all show, best ignored, as President-elect Biden was doing. But I was wrong. His pressure on GA officials showed open and clear attempts to overturn that state’s election. That alone, pre violence, was impeachable. Jonah has been right all along, again.

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    1. David Stewart

      The pressure that he put on Governor Kemp and Secretary of State Raffensperger, especially the now infamous phone call, alone ought to be enough for grounds for impeachment for atempted violation of the separation of powers between the levels of government in order to influence the outcome of an election. The riot is just the icing.

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      Hiawatha@Gmail.Com

      No offense to all, but it's not hard to be right about Donald Trump. The man's a bottomless well of corruption. Just assume the worst and you'll never be too far wrong.

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        John Kramer

        I don't know about that. I keep assuming the worst about Trump, and I'm always wildly wrong, because he's worse than I even thought possible. I thought he'd retaliate for Pence doing his job and certifying the election by instigating an epic round of mass departmental/diplomatic sackings to poison the well for Biden.

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    3. Counterpoint

      Agree, impeachable and criminal. I have always been very leery of pursuing criminal allegations against the Trump after he leaves office for actions while he was in office. I think I'm still of that mindset generally just because of the precedent pursuing charges would potentially create, but it will sting if he doesn't face any significant punishment for what he's done the last two months.

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      1. Jaybrown

        The only "punishment" he will really feel that he is at all likely to receive is humiliation in the eyes of his supporters. He is the one who will impose that upon himself.

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        1. Avatar photo
          Idontdocute

          I am sorry, and I am sincere, but he is not able to care about others if, as has been repeatedly forwarded, is a person with a narcissistic personality disorder. My example is one night while running a full code to save a lady, the patient who had this disorder walked into the room and turned off the lights to get us to stop and be quiet because he was not getting the sleep he needed to get better from his surgery. Mr Trump might always find an enemy and always have someone to blame for everything.

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