The DeSantis Dilemma

The Ron & Don show is officially on.

By , and
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With Donald Trump officially running for president, Ron DeSantis faces a twisted decision tree. Sarah, David, and Kevin are here to make sense of it.

Plus: how should the U.S. respond to the deadly missile incident in Poland? 

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  1. Carterbenes

    I’d like to suggest that all of the Dispatch podcasts (flagship, Dispatch, AO, etc.) be made available ad free on the website to paid subscribers.

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    Stevecplz

    I would like to see NATO use the missile strike in Poland as a pre-text to institute a no-fly/air defense zone, say a 50 or 100 mile buffer zone extending into Ukrainian air space. Any Russian missiles heading into said zone would be targeted and destroyed by NATO air defenses. Admittedly this does raise the risk of escalation, but it feels wrong to just let Russia target civilians with ballistic missiles without any type of consequence.

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    Ryan McKenzie

    The Sun Also Rises- Hemingway

    “Gradually, then suddenly” regarding bankruptcy.

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    Andy Napoli

    Sarah's question about Trump being a sore loser and running as an independent solely to tank DeSantis in a general election, is a real issue. I'd argue that THIS is the main reason why so many otherwise sensible Republican leaders have never broken decisively with Trump (McConnell refusing to convict; McCarthy groveling a week after January 6th, etc). Namely, that Trump is so spiteful that he'd rather destroy the GOP's chances to win at all, if he cannot be its unquestioned leader. The GOP's leaders like McConnell and McCarthy have self-rationalized their groveling and kneeling by telling themselves that there's no path to the GOP winning without Trump, but there still was a narrow path to winning power and elections WITH Trump. Given that perception (which isn't inaccurate BTW), their moral cowardice appears rational.

    I think 2022 has changed that calculus. It now seems increasingly clear that 2016 was the outlier (as was mentioned on the podcast) and that Trump is simply electoral poison. His obnoxiousness, incompetence, and open trolling of the libs doesn't merely juice GOP base turnout -- it also drives suburban, well-educated and otherwise generally conservative conservatives directly into the hands of the Democrats in any race where the candidate appears to be Trump or a Trumpkin clone. And on top of losing otherwise conservative or moderate GOP voters, Trump also turbocharges Democratic turnout like nobody else other than Obama. Maybe even better than Obama right now. There's a reason why voter turnout in the Trump era has broken records. It's because Trump really does make every election involving him, feel like an existential struggle. And Trump is incapable of making any election not all about himself, as 2022 has proven.

    So when GOP leaders and candidates come to the conclusion that they cannot win WITH Trump, but they might be able to win without him, that's when you will see things change. And I think we're at that point right now.

    I also totally agree with Kevin Williamson that DeSantis needs to summon a level of ruthlessness with Trump in any debates or in-person encounters, that will become the stuff of legend. In any debates with Trump, DeSantis needs to ruthlessly attack Trump's courage, competence, and manliness. "Why didn't you fire Fauci when you had the chance? Were you too chicken? Did your daughter or wife cuckcold you into inaction? I notice Ivanka isn't here tonight...." Nothing should be held back. The goal is to drive Trump into a complete, uncontrollable rage and meltdown. DeSantis should aim for the jugular every chance he gets, and remain completely calm. Totally ignore everything Trump says. That will only drive Trump into a rage. When Trump completely loses his cool -- like when he was hyperventilating and wandering behind HRC in 2016 in a menacing way -- DeSantis should start egging Trump on. "You got your fee-wings hurt, Donnie? You can dish but can't take? What are you going to do about it?" In a perfect world, Trump loses all control and comes at DeSantis to take a swing.

    In ancient honor cultures and warrior societies, tribal chieftains could be challenged. Usually because of a bad winter, a bad military campaign, or some other major loss for the tribe. But when the old tribal leader was defeated in the challenge, not only did he usually lose his life, but often his whole family was put to death, lest their exiled kin plot endlessly from afar to depose the new tribal leadership.

    DeSantis needs to treat his challenge in a similar way. Remember, there is a very good chance Trump will be indicted sometime in 2023 and certainly before the first 2024 primary is held. DeSantis needs to openly mention that if Trump fights him in the 2024 primary and loses, but concedes gratefully and backs him wholeheartedly, he will pardon Trump and his family. But if Trump acts like a spoiled b*tch, loses the primary, and then challenges DeSantis as an independent candidate, not only will DeSantis *not* pardon Trump and his family, he will be providing his full and wholehearted support to whatever further charges his DoJ deems appropriate. This needs to be done so publicly, and so ruthlessly, that all of MAGA sees that DeSantis means business, and that he is not a man to be trifled with. He needs to make it clear that he will destroy Trump and everything he holds dear, if Trump does not submit and bend the knee if he loses fair and square.

    If I was advising DeSantis, I'd formally have him invoke the ritual of the Holmgang -- a medieval Viking ritual -- at the first debate of 2024. To win over the MAGA barbarian hordes, he has to get medieval on Trump's ass.

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  5. Jason Fry

    I'm sorry Sarah, no self-respecting Texan would EVER refer to the food made from cornbread to go with Thanksgiving turkey as "stuffing." It's dressing, or more appropriately, "dressin" as in "we're havin' turkey n dressin." As my wife (who's mother grew up in central NY) commented, it makes us wonder if YOUR mother was not originally from Texas (I am fifth generation Texan, incidentially).

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  6. Moorechaos

    I live in Michigan but both my parents were born and raised in northern Alabama. We have cornbread dressing. I turn my nose up at stuffing mainly because I don't want to end up getting some kind of food poisoning from it, lol. Stuffing goes in the cavity of the turkey. Dressing is a side dish.

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    Mike B

    Does pumpkin pie count as a side dish, or is it officially dessert? Whichever, no holiday repast is complete without a generous slice of pumpkin pie, with either Kool Whip or (preferably) vanilla-bean ice cream, and strong, hot coffee (black for me, please, but cream and sugar are allowable for the more squeamish, such as my beloved wife).

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    Mike B

    I agree with David on the "world historic" nature of funding Ukraine. If they fail, it will be because the US failed to provide the means to prevail (with Ukrainian soldiers doing the bleeding and dying). And if Ukraine fails, it will be disastrous to civilization. We already failed to check Russian aggression in Syria and Georgia, and against Ukraine the first time around, in 2014 when they seized Crimea and the eastern Donbass. We (the west, led by the US) gave security guarantees in 1991 when Ukraine voluntarily gave up Soviet nukes stationed on their territory and again in the Minsk accords which effectively gave Russia Ukrainian land from which they launched this war. The US is morally obligated to support Ukraine with all the military assistance they need, and it is in our interest to do so.

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  9. Kyle C

    Dressing is cooked is a casserole dish and served on the side. Stuffing is stuffed in the bird.

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    1. Aaronhfrank

      Okay - first stuffing is no longer and has not been for at least a couple decades been cooked in the turkey. This is a major food safety hazard as it risks the stuffing never reaching a sufficient temp to kill the salmonella that may be in the turkey. You may cook your turkey this way but you put your Thanksgiving table at risk by doing so. If you must stuff your turkey the stuffing needs to heat to an internal temp of 165 which means that all the white meat in your bird will be bone dry and your dark meat probably will be as well.

      Raw flour is probably the biggest source of salmonella these days although many millers are now warning against its dangers too.

      Dressing also used to be cooked in the bird. My mom did it that way and she learned from her aunt who learned from her mom and so on. My mother learned to cook from her aunt who grew up in Louisville.

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      1. Echack

        However, if you heat up the stuffing to a high temperature when you stuff the bird, it isn't a risk.

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    SeanM76

    As an Arkansan I didn’t appreciate that shot Sarah. 😂

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