Reason and the Mob

Trump rivals can’t capitalize on his indictment.

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A supporter of former President Donald Trump poses for a photo while holding a banner referring to QAnon outside of the Trump National Doral resort on June 12, 2023, in Miami, Florida. (Photo by Stephanie Keith/Getty Images)

Yesterday was Arraignment Day. Tomorrow will mark one week since Indictment Day. Let’s check in with some Republican voters to see how they’re processing the news.

Darlene Doetzel lives in Michigan.

“Had it not been for the witch hunt, if they’d left him alone, I’d probably be for Ron DeSantis,” said Doetzel, a retiree and a devoted GOP activist wearing a pink blazer over a black T-shirt emblazoned with rhinestones that spelled out the word “Trump.”

“Since they’re persecuting my president,” she added, “I swear allegiance to him.”

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  1. J.R.Shaw

    Neuman / Moose, 2024.

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  2. Tom Johnson

    This is why we should switch to nonpartisan top-four jungle primaries. The hard core base has too much say in who get on the general election ballot. #VoteLikeAlaska

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  3. Pundette

    Also, as an aside, can you pardon someone who hasn't been convicted of anything? Didn't we go through this with the whole Bill Clinton/Marc Rich thing, where Clinton pardoned him while he was actually a fugitive from justice, which I think is not kosher.

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  4. Pundette

    Yes, the Right Fringe has lost its mind, but so has the Left Fringe. My ultra-progressive best friend told me that if Donald Trump won re-election in 2020, she hoped that she would contract Covid-19... and die.

    This means that Donald Trump had become the Most Important Person in Her Life, as he has become The Most Important Person in the lives of people on both fringes (more important, in this case, than her husband, children, grandchildren, relatives, friends, and co-workers).

    This is madness, mass psychosis -- on both sides.

    The Presidency is actually an inherently weak office, constitutionally; it was designed that way. The President, when behaving within constitutional constraints, has less power over Americans than, say, the U.K. Prime Minister has over Britons.

    But we can't wrap our heads around 535 separate personalities (and they've all abdicated their constitutional responsibilities in favor of being re-elected over and over and over and over again). But they're supposed to have more direct power over our lives. They make the laws; the President is only charged with enforcing them, the Court with making sure they pass constitutional muster.

    Hell, my local HOA had more direct power over my life, what I can and cannot do day-to-day, than the President does.

    But the current fascination with Harry and Megan and William and Kate shows just how much Americans still long for a King.

    Even a King who would trade them for a burger.

    However, I still think that the vast, vast majority of Americans on both sides of the political spectrum are weary of the Joe Show and the Don Show and would love to wrest our country from their grip.

    Let's vote. DeSantis/Scott 2024. ;-)

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    1. Avatar photo
      CP

      It’s supposed to be the weakest branch. It is becoming the strongest, and we will have a real tyranny on our hands within our lifetime if something doesn’t happen to prevent it. Look at how all of Congress kowtows to the executive branch. It’s because, as you say, the rabble want a king. Thank God that the Supreme Court does not, at least not yet.

      The only candidate passing my litmus test right now is Christie, God help us all.

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  5. R. James

    "I would be inclined in favor of a pardon."

    Nikki Haley "passed" the litmus test?!?

    What are you grading on the Gerald Ford curve?

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  6. Raincheck

    It’s easy to support Trump now. It’s just an answer to a pollster or a Twitter post. We won’t learn where the GOP really stands until the primaries heat up and people are looking at actually voting for who they are going to have run against Biden.

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  7. Dougrhon

    I am social media friends with David Marcus. He is an interesting guy, a good writer and definitely not a pure Trump cultist. But his obsession with the right being persecuted has blinded him to who Trump is and what he has done. I have pretty much stopped reading him. I am, btw, one of those commenters urging him to wake the hell up.

    In terms of what is happening in the Republican party, I honestly don't see a way for DeSantis or anyone else to get the nomination from Trump unless he implodes or something really crazy happens (An act of God perhaps). However, unlike others, I don't think a loss by RDS to Trump this year will ruin his future so long as he 1. Does not endorse Trump 2. Runs a conservative but sensible campaign to present himself as a conservative leader capable of governing successfully. If he bends the knee to Trump he will be finished. The Trump moment WILL pass. I believe it to my core. When that moment comes, anyone who stood by Trump will be ruined much like Democrats who supported the Iraq War were ruined, except worse.

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      Citizen60

      I always wonder Why the right thinks it’s being persecuted? Bloomberg wanted to limit soda sizes in New York? The government wanted Ammon Bundy to pay his overdue grazing fees?

      Between Rush Limbaugh and OAN, they’ve been told that endlessly for decades now. But where’s the evidence it’s true?

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      1. Avatar photo
        Bill Nelson

        Gas stoves. LGBTQ+. Guns. Cancel culture. It’s long list.
        I read a column about 20 years ago written by a conservative columnist that stated that it was considered “ok” to be rude to conservatives. This was a couple who lived in DC and socialized with many liberals.
        The mainstream press is largely liberal and they reflect those values.

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      2. Dougrhon

        Where did you get from my comment the idea that the right thinks it's persecuted? I swear I think people read what they want to read.

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        1. Midge

          From "his [Marcus's] obsession with the right being persecuted", I'd guess. Marcus is only one person, not the whole right, but it could remind people of their wonderment at people on the right more generally who feel persecuted.

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          1. Dougrhon

            Ah yes. There is certainly a portion that feels the right is being persecuted. I think each side tries to persecute the other. Trump just makes it so easy. The solution which eludes Marcus, to perceived selective persecution is to insist on equal justice. It's pretty messed up the degree to which Justice is stonewalling the Biden scandal when you think about how quickly and easily special prosecutors have been appointed to go after every administration from Reagan on. The Republican candidates would do well to condemn Trump and also promise to equally pursue wrongdoing without regard to party (they can add "as opposed to the current administration")

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  8. Just Dean

    Reason and the Mob
    Beauty and the Beast

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  9. Roger.Chylla

    I have started to come to the conclusion that too many Republicans just need the experience of losing to reform themselves. It saddens me to see Democrats controlling the executive branch for another 4-8 years as that endangers the most important legacy of the GOP (and Donald Trump) which is the reform of SCOTUS. This "deep state" nonsense has no future but the only way for too many Republicans to see that is to keep losing elections.

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    1. Aaronrc

      Don't you know that Trump didn't lose 2020, he had it taken away from him by the "deep state" rigging elections? If he loses another election, it'll only be because it's rigged.

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      1. Aaronrc

        I had a "close sarcasm" marker in there that seems to have been edited out somehow.

        But Trump has always played this game, and has taught it to the other right wingnuts. "Heads I win, tails, you lose." And at the far end of it is the death of the republic.

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      2. Just Dean

        He has never lost an election or primary, e.g., 2016 primary to Cruz, 2016 popular, 2020 popular and general. They have all been rigged or stolen.

        Does anyone see a pattern here?
        Does any reasonable person believe it will be any different in the future?

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      3. Roger.Chylla

        Yes it will take many more losses than just Trump losses for exactly the reasons you just said. :-(

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  10. AJLiberty

    I'm a pragmatist. Trump isn't dropping out to manage his legal affairs. The wheels of justice will move slowly here, especially with a judge that must learn all of the nuance of cases involving classified documents and how justice should handle a popular candidate for the highest office who will need to campaign. So, no resolution of legalities before GOP faithful start voting in the early primaries.

    Now we have upcoming debates. Can Christie qualify? Will Trump attend? Either way, I expect a lot of eyeballs trying to distinguish the field. I don't think Trump can attend with his legal jeopardy, though his ego and inability to let things go will strain this proposition. Assuming that he is not there and Christie is, then the question becomes one of strategy. Christie will undoubtedly come out hard and, like in his Townhall, put the others (assuming Hutchinson is not there) on account for not being honest about Trump's recklessness. How do they respond, especially DeSantis?

    DeSantis is 30pts down and foundering. He's nibbled at Trump but he's not made that full-throated prosecution why it should not be Trump. Will he do it at the debate? Will he come off well? Will right-wing media support a hard takedown or will they defend Trump and bite back? I'm not sure we know. FNC made some parries and fakes, but they are fighting OAN and Tucker for eyeballs. Trumpism cost them big bucks but how do they replace him?

    Me, I watch and can't stop shaking my head. It's like watching a car heading for a cliff...and you can't do anything about it. Sure I can send a few bucks to Christie...but there are no levers available to wake people up. Trump-happy people don't subscribe to The Dispatch. Maybe the debate, but the triad of DeSantis-Haley-Scott ths far have been so cautious about positioning that I fear we will just get more Biden's garage and Hillary's emails. That won't persuade the base to drop Trump. I guess we'll see...

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